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Hey there,


I want to first off note that I don’t want this to sound like a complaint. 🙏


I love Airtable, and I have used it now for 3 years across countless large organisations and medium-sized clients. Heart


I use it for everything I do. But there was always one part of the UX that I always saw stressing users out, and that was the way you can just click and accidentally add a brand new record at the bottom without ever meaning to. The process to create a record was so easy it was overwhelming, because to non-experienced, pressing command + z is often not learned, so they’d see Airtable as a place where it wasn’t safe to click anywhere (A problem later solved, in part for teams, by restricting people’s ability to add records in a base, or just using a sync so nobody can create records), and let’s not even talk about creating a record which is part of a filtered view because that’s just madness squared … But when teaching Airtable, all I’ve ever heard for 3 years now is a lot of “Whoops”…“Didn’t mean to do that”…“Whoops, where did that go?”, “Whoops, how do I?”/… etc etc etc


And even to experienced users, the daily mini-frustrations I, myself, have when accidentally creating a record and having to command + z was one thing I was sure that Airtable would fix sooner or later, so I didn’t let it bug me, and went on my merry way… Loving pretty much everything else about Airtable, creating thousands of accidental records along the way…“Whoops, command+z”



Then August 2020 hit, and they let a team mess around with the record creation flow, causing mayhem among my clients, and colleagues alike, creating, what I think is one of the longest threads on this community yet.


We all had a little moan, a little joke, and I think for the most part they changed the functionality back - even though, it’s still, in my opinion, clunkier than it was before it was messed with.


But then something happened about a month back… Whereby Airtable have given the field creation process the record treatment and made all sides of their app complete and utter minefields. So today, as I created my 10th accidental field of the day, I decided to write a polite petition to ask the UX designer and Product team…nay, BEG them to fix this!


Here’s my suggestion as an alternative:



  1. Keep the Plus signs. They’re nice and clear. Everyone is happy :green_circle:

  2. Please for the love of god stop messing with this empty space - This is important space that doesn’t need to be clickable 🔴



and …



  1. If you really, REALLY have to…Why not add a little friendly round button that a user can click on, so that we can all be very comfortable that this behaviour was intentional 🔵


It feels like this decision was made to increase field creation, which just seems mad to me. I typically want less fields…Not more! This is the graph of user frustration that I imagine the analytics doesn’t show:



Please say it’s not just me 😢


As a side note, I’ve actually been building my bases in Google Sheets recently, and my stress levels have been decreasing as a consequence, but it still feels a little like this


And as another side note…Airtable Product team - Sorry for the rant. I rant because I care :crazy_face: … You all rock 🤘 !

Hi all,


I’m Christy and I lead our product marketing team at Airtable. I apologize for the time it took for us to respond to this and the frustration you’re facing with accidental record creation.


Thank you so much for the candid feedback and insights. I wanted to give you additional background on why we rolled out this particular feature. We are always balancing the ways for our product to support our wide range of customers including those just getting started to those, like you, who are more seasoned experts.


For this particular change, I wanted to give you some background on why we’ve made the decisions we have:


We know that one of the biggest challenges new Airtable users face is getting their data out of where it’s currently stored and into Airtable. We also know that new Airtable users sometimes get confused about where they should add their information and that can keep them from getting value out of the tool right away.


By making it easy to add new records and fields to your Airtable base, we’ve seen new users get up and running with Airtable more quickly. Because we’ve seen such improvement from this design pattern with new users, we’ll be keeping it in place. That said, we recognize that this change is causing frustration for those that are very accustomed to using the product and hope that our future plans might help mitigate some frustration.


I realize that recognizing frustration isn’t the same as fixing it but I’m hoping that hearing the explanation of why we went in this direction will give you a greater understanding of our planning and decision-making process. We want to continue listening and collaborating with you every step of the way even if we disagree at times. With that in mind here are a few areas we are excited about (and hope you will be too!) with regards to product feedback and engagement:


Community engagement: Having an active, engaged community is not something we want to take for granted. In the coming months, we’ll be putting more resources towards our community program, including ways to keep our product team more involved in the community and give you more tools to give us feedback and get answers to your questions. We will be reaching out to many customers, including members of the Airtable Community to weigh in on our plans. You should start seeing and experiencing these changes during 2021.


Product updates: We know that being able to collaborate with team members, collaborators, and clients is key for workflows in Airtable. But we also know that it can be tricky. Different people need to see different cuts of data and not everyone should have the same level of editing access. Our team is actively working on giving you new collaboration tools and interfaces that help you manage your data in Airtable and better control so you can give your team members more of the information and data they need and less of what they don’t. We’ll be rolling out small collaboration improvements over the coming months, with a large update coming in the second half of this year.


I hope that peeling back the curtain on some of our internal processes and plans has helped give you more insight into our decision-making. Your feedback continues to be extremely valuable to us and we bring the feedback and requests we get from our community into our product road-mapping process each quarter as we create our plans and set our priorities.



Sure new individual users are important and I’m sure you investors like seeing your user count tick up as new individuals come on board to try things out. I love that AT is flexible, intuitive and easy to use, but it is possible for it to be ‘too easy’. Certainly it being so easy that you can really ‘accidentally’ discover how it’s done will quicken the pace, but once you stumble on this, users quickly get frustrated by that same accident when extraneous records or fields are regularly created and have to be cleaned up. I suppose it’s a delicate balance, but at some point of saturation you are going to run out of the pool of new users and will need to focus on the needs of your pro and enterprise users. There are some good ideas on this string for how to balance this.


Maybe another idea is that this is the way it works for free and plus users while pro/enterprise users that feature is turned off.



Sure new individual users are important and I’m sure you investors like seeing your user count tick up as new individuals come on board to try things out. I love that AT is flexible, intuitive and easy to use, but it is possible for it to be ‘too easy’. Certainly it being so easy that you can really ‘accidentally’ discover how it’s done will quicken the pace, but once you stumble on this, users quickly get frustrated by that same accident when extraneous records or fields are regularly created and have to be cleaned up. I suppose it’s a delicate balance, but at some point of saturation you are going to run out of the pool of new users and will need to focus on the needs of your pro and enterprise users. There are some good ideas on this string for how to balance this.


Maybe another idea is that this is the way it works for free and plus users while pro/enterprise users that feature is turned off.



This “feature” is not the reason new users adopt Airtable; adoption drivers is an entirely separate dimension.



In what database universe could anyone conclude that these actions should be considered equal?


In almost 100% of the successful database system designs, database schema actions are vastly kept separate from data capture actions because pretty much everyone - and by “everyone” I mean all 8 billion of us - spend a small amount of time configuring tables and sheets relative to the amount of time we spend adding data to them and working with them.


I predict …



  • The positive analytics you claim that are driving this decision to sustain this madness would likely be offset by magnitudes if you took the time to look at other analytics such as the number of times new fields are deleted shortly after mistakenly clicking in the grey area. Another useful metric is to examine the number of unused fields per table before this change and since this change.

  • The pressure to remedy this awkward behaviour will increase as consultants and users discover the impact of cleaning up messy tables.

  • It’s entirely likely you will see an increase in support calls related to the appearance of unexplained fields.

  • Airtable will eventually eliminate this “feature”; it’s just a matter of time before a few competitors use this as an example of poor design.



This “feature” is not the reason new users adopt Airtable; adoption drivers is an entirely separate dimension.



In what database universe could anyone conclude that these actions should be considered equal?


In almost 100% of the successful database system designs, database schema actions are vastly kept separate from data capture actions because pretty much everyone - and by “everyone” I mean all 8 billion of us - spend a small amount of time configuring tables and sheets relative to the amount of time we spend adding data to them and working with them.


I predict …



  • The positive analytics you claim that are driving this decision to sustain this madness would likely be offset by magnitudes if you took the time to look at other analytics such as the number of times new fields are deleted shortly after mistakenly clicking in the grey area. Another useful metric is to examine the number of unused fields per table before this change and since this change.

  • The pressure to remedy this awkward behaviour will increase as consultants and users discover the impact of cleaning up messy tables.

  • It’s entirely likely you will see an increase in support calls related to the appearance of unexplained fields.

  • Airtable will eventually eliminate this “feature”; it’s just a matter of time before a few competitors use this as an example of poor design.



I completely agree with this!



Consultants might be the exception to “everyone”. I expect that many consultants spend more time configuring things than manually adding data. However some of the most vocal complaints about this rampant creation of fields is coming from consultants who spend a greater portion of their time creating fields compared to other users.



I completely agree with this!



Consultants might be the exception to “everyone”. I expect that many consultants spend more time configuring things than manually adding data. However some of the most vocal complaints about this rampant creation of fields is coming from consultants who spend a greater portion of their time creating fields compared to other users.



Perhaps, but not if you factor in testing which probably makes it at least slightly more time performing tests than configuring. I’m fine with being right by just one millisecond. :winking_face:


Hi all,


I’m Christy and I lead our product marketing team at Airtable. I apologize for the time it took for us to respond to this and the frustration you’re facing with accidental record creation.


Thank you so much for the candid feedback and insights. I wanted to give you additional background on why we rolled out this particular feature. We are always balancing the ways for our product to support our wide range of customers including those just getting started to those, like you, who are more seasoned experts.


For this particular change, I wanted to give you some background on why we’ve made the decisions we have:


We know that one of the biggest challenges new Airtable users face is getting their data out of where it’s currently stored and into Airtable. We also know that new Airtable users sometimes get confused about where they should add their information and that can keep them from getting value out of the tool right away.


By making it easy to add new records and fields to your Airtable base, we’ve seen new users get up and running with Airtable more quickly. Because we’ve seen such improvement from this design pattern with new users, we’ll be keeping it in place. That said, we recognize that this change is causing frustration for those that are very accustomed to using the product and hope that our future plans might help mitigate some frustration.


I realize that recognizing frustration isn’t the same as fixing it but I’m hoping that hearing the explanation of why we went in this direction will give you a greater understanding of our planning and decision-making process. We want to continue listening and collaborating with you every step of the way even if we disagree at times. With that in mind here are a few areas we are excited about (and hope you will be too!) with regards to product feedback and engagement:


Community engagement: Having an active, engaged community is not something we want to take for granted. In the coming months, we’ll be putting more resources towards our community program, including ways to keep our product team more involved in the community and give you more tools to give us feedback and get answers to your questions. We will be reaching out to many customers, including members of the Airtable Community to weigh in on our plans. You should start seeing and experiencing these changes during 2021.


Product updates: We know that being able to collaborate with team members, collaborators, and clients is key for workflows in Airtable. But we also know that it can be tricky. Different people need to see different cuts of data and not everyone should have the same level of editing access. Our team is actively working on giving you new collaboration tools and interfaces that help you manage your data in Airtable and better control so you can give your team members more of the information and data they need and less of what they don’t. We’ll be rolling out small collaboration improvements over the coming months, with a large update coming in the second half of this year.


I hope that peeling back the curtain on some of our internal processes and plans has helped give you more insight into our decision-making. Your feedback continues to be extremely valuable to us and we bring the feedback and requests we get from our community into our product road-mapping process each quarter as we create our plans and set our priorities.


Welcome to the community, @Christy_Roach!


Thank you for chiming in here, but I am beyond disappointed & beyond frustrated with your message. I am essentially in a state of shock over what you have written.


I will really need to calm down before I type up a full reply, because I am just too shocked right now at what you said.


You have essentially doubled down on everything we have been complaining about.



Perhaps, but not if you factor in testing which probably makes it at least slightly more time performing tests than configuring. I’m fine with being right by just one millisecond. :winking_face:



Lol. Yes, I spend a lot of time in testing. However I try to import my test data whenever possible, which speeds things up, and which I don’t consider that to be the same as manual data entry (which is what is sped up by clicking that bar to create new records).


I echo literally every response here! Airtable, you broke my heart.



Hi all,


I’m Christy and I lead our product marketing team at Airtable. I apologize for the time it took for us to respond to this and the frustration you’re facing with accidental record creation.


Thank you so much for the candid feedback and insights. I wanted to give you additional background on why we rolled out this particular feature. We are always balancing the ways for our product to support our wide range of customers including those just getting started to those, like you, who are more seasoned experts.


For this particular change, I wanted to give you some background on why we’ve made the decisions we have:


We know that one of the biggest challenges new Airtable users face is getting their data out of where it’s currently stored and into Airtable. We also know that new Airtable users sometimes get confused about where they should add their information and that can keep them from getting value out of the tool right away.


By making it easy to add new records and fields to your Airtable base, we’ve seen new users get up and running with Airtable more quickly. Because we’ve seen such improvement from this design pattern with new users, we’ll be keeping it in place. That said, we recognize that this change is causing frustration for those that are very accustomed to using the product and hope that our future plans might help mitigate some frustration.


I realize that recognizing frustration isn’t the same as fixing it but I’m hoping that hearing the explanation of why we went in this direction will give you a greater understanding of our planning and decision-making process. We want to continue listening and collaborating with you every step of the way even if we disagree at times. With that in mind here are a few areas we are excited about (and hope you will be too!) with regards to product feedback and engagement:


Community engagement: Having an active, engaged community is not something we want to take for granted. In the coming months, we’ll be putting more resources towards our community program, including ways to keep our product team more involved in the community and give you more tools to give us feedback and get answers to your questions. We will be reaching out to many customers, including members of the Airtable Community to weigh in on our plans. You should start seeing and experiencing these changes during 2021.


Product updates: We know that being able to collaborate with team members, collaborators, and clients is key for workflows in Airtable. But we also know that it can be tricky. Different people need to see different cuts of data and not everyone should have the same level of editing access. Our team is actively working on giving you new collaboration tools and interfaces that help you manage your data in Airtable and better control so you can give your team members more of the information and data they need and less of what they don’t. We’ll be rolling out small collaboration improvements over the coming months, with a large update coming in the second half of this year.


I hope that peeling back the curtain on some of our internal processes and plans has helped give you more insight into our decision-making. Your feedback continues to be extremely valuable to us and we bring the feedback and requests we get from our community into our product road-mapping process each quarter as we create our plans and set our priorities.


Unfortunately, the new users are not the ones who are paying employments salaries.

I have a small Real Estate Agency, and our annual cost is around 2k per year. Yes maybe it is not much. but all of my employees, are not new users (4 years we are using airtable), and yet as pointed by so many people, it is clear that your statistics were wrong. It is quite significant amount of time. And many people are not aware of these accidental, or they are really stressed where to click , while they have in mind to fill or edit data in a cell. So in terms of User Experience, airtable has failed listening their users-customers. And they are the one who will bring more…Not the customers who have a free plan and use airtable just to plan some recipes or keep an inventory of their shoes.

All these are nice. At least you could give an option like, advanced mode, or expert mode, like many apps have which hides many unnecessary buttons or UI elements.

The latest update 1.14.0 was crashing for 3 days, giving to our company big nightmare due to recent changes we did in the structure and we thought it was our fault.

It is very simple. People want to have their data

Safe,

Easy to access,

End easy to connect them.


Input data, is easy by default…no need for reinventing the wheel here.

End of story.


OK, I had a good laugh on @Bill.French Bill French’s AirtablEconomics/AirtableErgonomics theory. So let us stretch it further then. So maybe it’s all intended strategy of Airtable and we just don’t understand the strategy because we are not the insiders. It could be this is a smart strategy by Airtable to drive out competitors from business. You know, the same way as spy agencies deploy their active measures… YES, that’s what I was thinking. It’s Airtable active measures counter-copy-cat technique as part of their advanced defensive strategies initiatives at Airtable. Why, OK here is the proof. Why would even such a smart cⓚⓚkie copy-cat mastermind CEO Rachit Khator fall easily for such a trick. The reason why Airtable has these plus-signs as an excellent “Feature” is to have Stackby to copy them. By having Stackby copy this excellent feature, their users have to suffer and as result of that Airtable could potentially see Stackby or maybe others taking away less clients from Airtable because everybody would say, if I have to suffer, then better suffer well and hope Airtable will invent some more new punishing features.


Anyway, that’s my Friday’s late-evening theory I just came up now.



Hi all,


I’m Christy and I lead our product marketing team at Airtable. I apologize for the time it took for us to respond to this and the frustration you’re facing with accidental record creation.


Thank you so much for the candid feedback and insights. I wanted to give you additional background on why we rolled out this particular feature. We are always balancing the ways for our product to support our wide range of customers including those just getting started to those, like you, who are more seasoned experts.


For this particular change, I wanted to give you some background on why we’ve made the decisions we have:


We know that one of the biggest challenges new Airtable users face is getting their data out of where it’s currently stored and into Airtable. We also know that new Airtable users sometimes get confused about where they should add their information and that can keep them from getting value out of the tool right away.


By making it easy to add new records and fields to your Airtable base, we’ve seen new users get up and running with Airtable more quickly. Because we’ve seen such improvement from this design pattern with new users, we’ll be keeping it in place. That said, we recognize that this change is causing frustration for those that are very accustomed to using the product and hope that our future plans might help mitigate some frustration.


I realize that recognizing frustration isn’t the same as fixing it but I’m hoping that hearing the explanation of why we went in this direction will give you a greater understanding of our planning and decision-making process. We want to continue listening and collaborating with you every step of the way even if we disagree at times. With that in mind here are a few areas we are excited about (and hope you will be too!) with regards to product feedback and engagement:


Community engagement: Having an active, engaged community is not something we want to take for granted. In the coming months, we’ll be putting more resources towards our community program, including ways to keep our product team more involved in the community and give you more tools to give us feedback and get answers to your questions. We will be reaching out to many customers, including members of the Airtable Community to weigh in on our plans. You should start seeing and experiencing these changes during 2021.


Product updates: We know that being able to collaborate with team members, collaborators, and clients is key for workflows in Airtable. But we also know that it can be tricky. Different people need to see different cuts of data and not everyone should have the same level of editing access. Our team is actively working on giving you new collaboration tools and interfaces that help you manage your data in Airtable and better control so you can give your team members more of the information and data they need and less of what they don’t. We’ll be rolling out small collaboration improvements over the coming months, with a large update coming in the second half of this year.


I hope that peeling back the curtain on some of our internal processes and plans has helped give you more insight into our decision-making. Your feedback continues to be extremely valuable to us and we bring the feedback and requests we get from our community into our product road-mapping process each quarter as we create our plans and set our priorities.


Hi @Christy_Roach,


I always want to thank the Department Leaders of Airtable who take the time to get down into the arena by going to our contact in the community.

Although I recently confessed in the Community that I have spent time on a Glue-Factory NOcode, I am still a very well educated student by the best and most generous Experts of their teaching here, both Airtable and Independent, which is even more generous, and I do not deny the prior analysis of the data, neither the development of a model, nor the code written in a self-critical and increasingly challenging way, nor the NOcode well used, and I don’t take myself for a NOcode and Glu-Factory Conductor considering the fact that I haven’t practised symphonic music of workflows, integrations, automations enough yet.

Thanks to my algorithm and programming Teachers and thanks to the Community for giving us this chance to be well educated.

It is in this context that I’m proposing you the following option:

Leave the choice (a switch has two positions on the UI) to everyone between the “classical” UI/UX and the criticized and even shot UI/UX here. Either via a Switch, or via a Menu like the “theme” Menu of some Apps?

Does it make sense ?

Cheers,

olπ


@Christy_Roach, thank you for giving us an insight into the future collaboration enhancements. Those have been much needed for years.


And yes, I sincerely hope that Airtable creates more community engagement with us, particularly Airtable consultants like myself who interact with dozens of Airtable users every week. We are in the trenches every day, and we know what the users are saying about the product.


In general, it seems like Airtable is more concerned about attracting new users to the platform, but Airtable is not paying attention to the people who are LEAVING the platform and THE REASONS WHY they are leaving the platform.


Airtable thinks they’re filling a bucket with tons of customers, but they’re not paying attention to the hole at the bottom of the bucket which is leaking customers & causing people who were once fans of the product to badmouth the product instead.


As a full-time professional Airtable consultant, every time someone leaves the Airtable platform, it weakens the platform and it hurts my future income.


It is shocking to me that Airtable can’t understand how detrimental it is to ALL USERS (new & old) for the entire right side of the screen to create a new field. This simply can NOT be the final outcome of this feature. It’s simply not acceptable.


But this feature is not the only major product flaw.


I have been keeping an internal list of over 200 product flaws like this in the product that my clients have complained about (and most of these product flaws have been complained about for years in these forums).


Here is just one example out of over 200 Airtable product flaws, but this one hurt me big time:


I just lost a very lucrative Airtable client last week because Airtable has never bothered to fix their mobile views. Did you know that Airtable’s mobile views do not allow searching, sorting, filtering, or grouping?


My client’s website depended heavily on Airtable-embedded views — BUT most of their customers use mobile devices to browse their website (as do the majority of people using the Internet).


But, lo and behold, despite years of user complaints about this issue, Airtable has refused to allow grouping, searching, sorting, and filtering on the mobile views. It’s available on desktop, but not on mobile. In other words, Airtable’s mobile views are 95% useless.


My client even emailed Airtable Support about this, and their unhelpful response was: “We can see how fully-functional mobile views could be helpful, but it’s not on our roadmap.”


To give some context:


My client has a website of government-related data that his customers pay a monthly subscription to access. When they pay for their monthly subscription, they get a password to access the “membership-only pages” of his website. In other words, his customers are simply paying for access to data that he keeps in his database.


He has about 25 different pages on his paid website, and each one of these 25 pages had an embedded Airtable view on it. These embedded views worked just fine on a desktop web browser — his members could group, filter, sort, and search on desktop.


But since most of his customers are logging in from a mobile device (just like most of the world is doing), they could no longer group, filter, sort, and search!


This made the user experience terrible for his customers, because they could not spend their days scrolling endlessly through hundreds (or thousands) of records.


Airtable has ignored the mobile experience, even though the vast majority of users access the Internet from a mobile device.


So now, this client of mine has left Airtable, and even worse, he is now badmouthing the platform to his customers.


You guys are generating bad-will instead of goodwill.


I’ve seen clients leave the platform more than once. When people leave Airtable, they’re angry about it. They wanted to stay, and they wanted to love the product. They were once cheerleaders for the product, and then they turned against it.


Even simple & tiny product tweaks that would’ve kept customers using the Airtable platform have been ignored for years.


Simple tweaks like:


(1) giving us calendars that work outside of the United States (we’re one of the few countries where our weeks start on Sunday),

(2) currency formatting that works outside of the United States (50% of countries swap their commas and periods),

(3) column headers that are resizable for long titles.


All 3 of these very simple things have caused me to lose clients, and have caused Airtable to lose customers who now badmouth the platform.


And people have been complaining about these simple needs for years. These aren’t new complaints.


And of course there are much bigger product issues, too! For example:

(1) Page Designer is flawed in many ways, but it also can’t be automated in any way, and it can’t create pdf files.

(2) The “Find a record” automation action lets us use dynamic variables as conditional filters, but that feature hasn’t found its way to lookup fields or rollup fields or linked record fields.

(3) Buttons can’t trigger automations nor silently run scripts.

(4) Automations can’t interact with apps.

(5) Almost no apps support printing, such as the chart app.


This is just a tiny list of the product issues that cause people to leave Airtable for competitors.


Anyways, thank you for posting here. I really hope that this is the beginning of a new chapter. 🙏


p.s. Seriously, that right margin thing needs to go.


@Christy_Roach, thank you for giving us an insight into the future collaboration enhancements. Those have been much needed for years.


And yes, I sincerely hope that Airtable creates more community engagement with us, particularly Airtable consultants like myself who interact with dozens of Airtable users every week. We are in the trenches every day, and we know what the users are saying about the product.


In general, it seems like Airtable is more concerned about attracting new users to the platform, but Airtable is not paying attention to the people who are LEAVING the platform and THE REASONS WHY they are leaving the platform.


Airtable thinks they’re filling a bucket with tons of customers, but they’re not paying attention to the hole at the bottom of the bucket which is leaking customers & causing people who were once fans of the product to badmouth the product instead.


As a full-time professional Airtable consultant, every time someone leaves the Airtable platform, it weakens the platform and it hurts my future income.


It is shocking to me that Airtable can’t understand how detrimental it is to ALL USERS (new & old) for the entire right side of the screen to create a new field. This simply can NOT be the final outcome of this feature. It’s simply not acceptable.


But this feature is not the only major product flaw.


I have been keeping an internal list of over 200 product flaws like this in the product that my clients have complained about (and most of these product flaws have been complained about for years in these forums).


Here is just one example out of over 200 Airtable product flaws, but this one hurt me big time:


I just lost a very lucrative Airtable client last week because Airtable has never bothered to fix their mobile views. Did you know that Airtable’s mobile views do not allow searching, sorting, filtering, or grouping?


My client’s website depended heavily on Airtable-embedded views — BUT most of their customers use mobile devices to browse their website (as do the majority of people using the Internet).


But, lo and behold, despite years of user complaints about this issue, Airtable has refused to allow grouping, searching, sorting, and filtering on the mobile views. It’s available on desktop, but not on mobile. In other words, Airtable’s mobile views are 95% useless.


My client even emailed Airtable Support about this, and their unhelpful response was: “We can see how fully-functional mobile views could be helpful, but it’s not on our roadmap.”


To give some context:


My client has a website of government-related data that his customers pay a monthly subscription to access. When they pay for their monthly subscription, they get a password to access the “membership-only pages” of his website. In other words, his customers are simply paying for access to data that he keeps in his database.


He has about 25 different pages on his paid website, and each one of these 25 pages had an embedded Airtable view on it. These embedded views worked just fine on a desktop web browser — his members could group, filter, sort, and search on desktop.


But since most of his customers are logging in from a mobile device (just like most of the world is doing), they could no longer group, filter, sort, and search!


This made the user experience terrible for his customers, because they could not spend their days scrolling endlessly through hundreds (or thousands) of records.


Airtable has ignored the mobile experience, even though the vast majority of users access the Internet from a mobile device.


So now, this client of mine has left Airtable, and even worse, he is now badmouthing the platform to his customers.


You guys are generating bad-will instead of goodwill.


I’ve seen clients leave the platform more than once. When people leave Airtable, they’re angry about it. They wanted to stay, and they wanted to love the product. They were once cheerleaders for the product, and then they turned against it.


Even simple & tiny product tweaks that would’ve kept customers using the Airtable platform have been ignored for years.


Simple tweaks like:


(1) giving us calendars that work outside of the United States (we’re one of the few countries where our weeks start on Sunday),

(2) currency formatting that works outside of the United States (50% of countries swap their commas and periods),

(3) column headers that are resizable for long titles.


All 3 of these very simple things have caused me to lose clients, and have caused Airtable to lose customers who now badmouth the platform.


And people have been complaining about these simple needs for years. These aren’t new complaints.


And of course there are much bigger product issues, too! For example:

(1) Page Designer is flawed in many ways, but it also can’t be automated in any way, and it can’t create pdf files.

(2) The “Find a record” automation action lets us use dynamic variables as conditional filters, but that feature hasn’t found its way to lookup fields or rollup fields or linked record fields.

(3) Buttons can’t trigger automations nor silently run scripts.

(4) Automations can’t interact with apps.

(5) Almost no apps support printing, such as the chart app.


This is just a tiny list of the product issues that cause people to leave Airtable for competitors.


Anyways, thank you for posting here. I really hope that this is the beginning of a new chapter. 🙏


p.s. Seriously, that right margin thing needs to go.


Hi @ScottWorld, @Christy_Roach ,



Ignoring the mobile experience:

It caused me to have to take care of this myself, via the API.

Anyway, I’m not quite done yet…

…and it will not replace word for word what your VIEWs are made of.



Yes +++



I had suggested that you make this draft App open, so that the Custom App Developers of the Community could improve it and make it automatable but “this App is not openable” has been very kindly explained to me (by your DEV) because it has not been designed with the public tools of Custom App SDK I could understand.

But no other AT’s developed version came to replace the one we are complaining about, here, here, and here, for a long time.

Doing this outside of Airtable has been demonstrated to us by Community top-level Expert, yes, but how many hours does it take to learn how to do it, in SDK that is not AT Custom App SDK ?!?



Thanks to @ScottWorld for compiling a certain number of these points out of his own Customers reviews:

I’m quoting reviews I’ve experienced too !


I’m working alone with a limited budget that has long since been surpassed by the need to pay for Third-Parts (thus Dependencies) to get some functional workarounds before my personal code packages are tested and finalised.


In addition to be some kind of passionate and mindful Student of R&D best practices taught by the best Experts in the Community, I am also the kind of outsider who pays for a Pro Non-Profit account at Airtable for the sole purpose of research in workflow, integration, automation in the context of a majority use of TEXT such as Data-IN and Data-Out although I do not have time to care any Customer.


In other words, my own Account analytics owned by your company which must bear witness to this: I sometimes spend most of my time on Airtable for several weeks in a row.

Do you hire some part-time TEXT-based Data Airtable Test-Pilot ? :winking_face:


My feedback remixed with those of the Experts who have Clients, a lot of Clients do not come from a small Saturday’s Office lone Man who does not think much about the problems encountered in the use / scripting of Airtable as well as in the elaboration of workarounds.


Cheers,


olπ


@Christy_Roach:


Back to the topic at hand:


Are you curious as to why your initial message is so upsetting to me?


For you to come out of the gates by defending one of the most misguided interface decisions in Airtable’s history doesn’t seem to bode well for the future of the platform.


If you are the new product manager for Airtable & you believe that making the entire right-hand side of the screen create new fields is acceptable, then all of us users have officially lost the war in trying to break through to the deaf ears & blind eyes & turned backs at Airtable.


If your message above represents the future of “listening to us”, then it doesn’t give me high hopes for the future of this platform. I should just give up now.


Here are some questions for you, Christy:




  1. Once a database system is finished being built, how many times do users need to create new fields? Zero.




  2. Once a brand new user learns how to create a new field in their very first 30 seconds of using Airtable (and it’s not too difficult to find the + sign in the toolbar), how many times do you think they will ever be confused after their first 30 seconds? Zero.




  3. Why would you ruin an entire product’s user experience for 99.99% of your users, in order to cater to new users in their first 30 seconds of using the product?




  4. How can you possibly equate creating new records with creating new fields? One of these activities is done thousands of times per day; the other activity is done ONCE. Not once per day. ONCE ONLY.




  5. Why would you make it so easy for users to accidentally create new fields throughout the day? Bosses & managers who create databases for their users don’t want their users accidentally changing the structure of their database throughout the day while using the system.




While there were some positive glimmers of hope in your post, I am not feeling very optimistic about the future.


@Christy_Roach:


Back to the topic at hand:


Are you curious as to why your initial message is so upsetting to me?


For you to come out of the gates by defending one of the most misguided interface decisions in Airtable’s history doesn’t seem to bode well for the future of the platform.


If you are the new product manager for Airtable & you believe that making the entire right-hand side of the screen create new fields is acceptable, then all of us users have officially lost the war in trying to break through to the deaf ears & blind eyes & turned backs at Airtable.


If your message above represents the future of “listening to us”, then it doesn’t give me high hopes for the future of this platform. I should just give up now.


Here are some questions for you, Christy:




  1. Once a database system is finished being built, how many times do users need to create new fields? Zero.




  2. Once a brand new user learns how to create a new field in their very first 30 seconds of using Airtable (and it’s not too difficult to find the + sign in the toolbar), how many times do you think they will ever be confused after their first 30 seconds? Zero.




  3. Why would you ruin an entire product’s user experience for 99.99% of your users, in order to cater to new users in their first 30 seconds of using the product?




  4. How can you possibly equate creating new records with creating new fields? One of these activities is done thousands of times per day; the other activity is done ONCE. Not once per day. ONCE ONLY.




  5. Why would you make it so easy for users to accidentally create new fields throughout the day? Bosses & managers who create databases for their users don’t want their users accidentally changing the structure of their database throughout the day while using the system.




While there were some positive glimmers of hope in your post, I am not feeling very optimistic about the future.


I hope you don’t mind that I take a stab at answering some of these questions, even though they weren’t directed at me. Keep in mind that I do not like the current design.



But when is a database system ever truly finished? Many of my bases are constantly evolving. I can say that a client base is finished when I turn the base over and close out the project, but in reality, the client might want to change things later.


Also, I commonly use one-off bases like scratch paper. These bases are never finished, and they never need to be.



That 30 seconds can be a very long time for someone who is used to working with a spreadsheet and is considering Airtable. And in my experience watching people, it can be longer than 30 seconds.


Also, I think you overestimate the ability of people to forget how to do things if it’s been a while since they’ve done it. People coming from a spreadsheet point of view expect to be able to type in a cell when they scroll to the right.



It’s a lot more than the first 30 seconds, per my previous comments.



I think that community members made the link between creating new records and creating new fields because we don’t like the current functionality.


I think that the ability again stems from people coming from a spreadsheet background, where people are used to an endless canvas where they can easily see new rows and columns.


I personally think that Airtable’s UI/UX should do a better job of gently coaxing new users to realize that Airtable is a database and not a spreadsheet, rather than trying to copy a spreadsheet experience.



Maybe those bosses and managers should have their users have editor permissions instead of creator permissions.


I hope you don’t mind that I take a stab at answering some of these questions, even though they weren’t directed at me. Keep in mind that I do not like the current design.



But when is a database system ever truly finished? Many of my bases are constantly evolving. I can say that a client base is finished when I turn the base over and close out the project, but in reality, the client might want to change things later.


Also, I commonly use one-off bases like scratch paper. These bases are never finished, and they never need to be.



That 30 seconds can be a very long time for someone who is used to working with a spreadsheet and is considering Airtable. And in my experience watching people, it can be longer than 30 seconds.


Also, I think you overestimate the ability of people to forget how to do things if it’s been a while since they’ve done it. People coming from a spreadsheet point of view expect to be able to type in a cell when they scroll to the right.



It’s a lot more than the first 30 seconds, per my previous comments.



I think that community members made the link between creating new records and creating new fields because we don’t like the current functionality.


I think that the ability again stems from people coming from a spreadsheet background, where people are used to an endless canvas where they can easily see new rows and columns.


I personally think that Airtable’s UI/UX should do a better job of gently coaxing new users to realize that Airtable is a database and not a spreadsheet, rather than trying to copy a spreadsheet experience.



Maybe those bosses and managers should have their users have editor permissions instead of creator permissions.


@kuovonne I replied to your comment shortly after you wrote it, but the forum auto-flagged my response. :man_shrugging: Hopefully, it will get approved on Monday.


I’m also taking wagers that we will never again hear from an Airtable employee in this thread.


Hi all,


I’m Christy and I lead our product marketing team at Airtable. I apologize for the time it took for us to respond to this and the frustration you’re facing with accidental record creation.


Thank you so much for the candid feedback and insights. I wanted to give you additional background on why we rolled out this particular feature. We are always balancing the ways for our product to support our wide range of customers including those just getting started to those, like you, who are more seasoned experts.


For this particular change, I wanted to give you some background on why we’ve made the decisions we have:


We know that one of the biggest challenges new Airtable users face is getting their data out of where it’s currently stored and into Airtable. We also know that new Airtable users sometimes get confused about where they should add their information and that can keep them from getting value out of the tool right away.


By making it easy to add new records and fields to your Airtable base, we’ve seen new users get up and running with Airtable more quickly. Because we’ve seen such improvement from this design pattern with new users, we’ll be keeping it in place. That said, we recognize that this change is causing frustration for those that are very accustomed to using the product and hope that our future plans might help mitigate some frustration.


I realize that recognizing frustration isn’t the same as fixing it but I’m hoping that hearing the explanation of why we went in this direction will give you a greater understanding of our planning and decision-making process. We want to continue listening and collaborating with you every step of the way even if we disagree at times. With that in mind here are a few areas we are excited about (and hope you will be too!) with regards to product feedback and engagement:


Community engagement: Having an active, engaged community is not something we want to take for granted. In the coming months, we’ll be putting more resources towards our community program, including ways to keep our product team more involved in the community and give you more tools to give us feedback and get answers to your questions. We will be reaching out to many customers, including members of the Airtable Community to weigh in on our plans. You should start seeing and experiencing these changes during 2021.


Product updates: We know that being able to collaborate with team members, collaborators, and clients is key for workflows in Airtable. But we also know that it can be tricky. Different people need to see different cuts of data and not everyone should have the same level of editing access. Our team is actively working on giving you new collaboration tools and interfaces that help you manage your data in Airtable and better control so you can give your team members more of the information and data they need and less of what they don’t. We’ll be rolling out small collaboration improvements over the coming months, with a large update coming in the second half of this year.


I hope that peeling back the curtain on some of our internal processes and plans has helped give you more insight into our decision-making. Your feedback continues to be extremely valuable to us and we bring the feedback and requests we get from our community into our product road-mapping process each quarter as we create our plans and set our priorities.


Quoted for Posterity:



Welcome to the Airtable community @Christy_Roach!


Thank you for taking the time to join the community and pull back the curtain a little.



Recognizing frustration is an important first step. Finding the right UX/UI design can be tricky, and recognizing pain points for everyone (new users, existing users, power users, etc.) is important. In this case, it feels like Airtable prioritized new users over existing users.


In my experience, new Airtable users do best when they either (1) have database experience already or (2) were personally introduced to Airtable by someone they know who already uses and likes Airtable. In addition to focusing on brand new users, maybe there can be an approach that supports the “mentoring” process beyond giving free credits for new account referrals?



I’m really sad to hear this. I believe that there are other UX/UI designs that could better accommodate both new and existing users. I suggested one upthread (or possibly in one of the related threads on this topic).



I’m super excited to hear this and look forward to seeing the changes. I’m also happy to provide feedback.



Being able to set permissions on who can see what would be huge. Note that this is different from more variations on personal views, since personal views don’t really restrict what a person can see.



I hope that you will announce these improvements in the community so that there will be official threads to post comments on. The announcements could include information on the rollout and how to provide feedback. In the past a few people discover new features and start their own threads, which leads to disjointed information and confusion when different people have different experiences.


The prospect of a large update in the second half of this year is also exciting. Thank you for this rare peak at your roadmap.



Like in all good relationships, communication is key. If they start with that, it will at least take away the biggest frustration of all: talking to walls in this community.


Let’s hope for the best…



I want to emphasise “years” here… YEARS!



+1


Just everything that @ScottWorld says.


@ScottWorld I think you and I have different experiences.


While I still create fields accidentally, I probably don’t do it quite as often as you, and it doesn’t seem to bother me as much as it bothers you. I am not accidentally creating 10 new fields in one day. Maybe it is because we do slightly different work. Maybe it is the arrangement of our screens. Maybe it is something else. I also rarely do development work on an iPad anymore.


When I click to the right of the grid in Airtable, 99.99% of the time it is to clear the focus. However, When I am in a spreadsheet that percentage goes way down, because I also click to the right of existing data to add new data.


I still think you are overestimating the learning and forgetting curve for creating new fields. I have seen multiple users of Airtable who have been using Airtable for over a year who still don’t remember how to create a field, even though they have done it multiple times before. Configuring Airtable is such a tiny portion of their time that how to create a new field simply isn’t important enough to remember. They figuring it out (or hire me) and then forget a month later when they want a new field again.


As for taking time to delete extraneous fields in a client’s base, that is a personal business decision. As annoying as they are, the extraneous fields do not prevent users from using the base as intended.


I agree that Airtable should not try to cater to spreadsheet users by recreating aspects of the spreadsheet experience that do not make sense in a database environment. However, I think that Airtable should cater to spreadsheet users to ease them in the mental shift between spreadsheet and database.


Maybe the user experience researchers that Airtable wants to hire will be able to do research into how often people create records by clicking to the right of the grid, but don’t actually follow through on configuring the field. Hopefully the researchers will be perceptive enough to tell when creating the field was done in error versus users needing more guidance on configuring the field.


As for bosses and managers being creators–yeah, it would be nice if there were a quicker, easier method to set permissions for using a base.



Thank you for reminding @Christy_Roach that you are also NOT in favor of this design decision.


And I appreciate you playing devil’s advocate here, so I can respond to your comments:



This is totally true. A database system is never truly finished.


But 2 important things to note here:



  1. Creating new fields is only a small part of continually evolving a database system. There are so many other things that have nothing to do with creating new fields: Automations, views, scripts, external tools, apps, etc. The amount of times that we are now accidentally prompted with creating a new field is absolutely disproportionate to the amount of times that we actually NEED to create a new field.

  2. Anybody who is actually developing the system knows how to create new fields. When people are clicking to the right of the grid with their mouse, they are always doing it to clear their cursor from being inside one of the fields. They are doing it to clear the drop-down menu in a single-select field, or they are doing it to clear the drop-down choices in a linked record fields, or they are doing it to clear the drop-down choices in a multi-select field. etc. etc.


Even people who are using Microsoft Excel are accustomed to the same behavior: When a dropdown menu appears in Excel, they click into an empty area of the screen to clear the dropdown menu.


It concerns me that Christy and her team are not actually watching how people are using their mouse throughout their experience with Airtable. As @Bill.French said above, if Airtable was paying attention to their users’ behaviors, Airtable would see how many dozens of times per day users create & then cancel out of creating a new field.


A surprise interface element should never pop up on their screen, when all the user wanted to do was clear their cursor from a field.



Sure, but people are only a new user once. On their very first day of using the product. Even if it takes them 5 minutes to figure out how to create a new field, I don’t believe that the entire interface should then be ruined from that point forward into the future, simply because we wanted to help a brand new user on their very first day of using Airtable who doesn’t want to spend a few moments to learn a new platform.


In my personal case: I use Airtable on both a Mac web browser & an iPad web browser (where Airtable finally works properly with scrolling!), and the hundreds of times I have now accidentally created new fields in the last 2 months is mind-boggling.


It’s especially difficult on the iPad, where there’s not much screen space to begin with. All I want to do is clear my cursor out of a single-select field, or clear my cursor out of a multi-select field, etc… but nope, the new field dialog box pops up every time I accidentally tap to the right of the grid.


What Christy and the Airtable Team don’t seem to understand is that every time I log into a client’s Airtable database to help them with their system, I have to clean up all of the extraneous fields that my client has created in their system.


How is this making people’s lives easier?


What Airtable fails to understand is that users instinctively want to click to the right of the grid to clear the mouse from a field.


Even people who come from a spreadsheet background instinctively click to the right of their fields (or in any blank area of the screen) to clear a drop-down list in their Excel spreadsheet. Where else would a user go to clear a drop-down list?



Yes, but we shouldn’t debilitate our product for ALL users in order to cater to NEW users in order to “baby them” into a new product. They should simply do what everyone else has done: learn the new product. Creating a field is easy.


We can’t damage an entire platform to cater to new users who don’t want to spend a few minutes learning how the brand new platform works. It makes no sense.


If Steve Jobs wanted to cater to people who were accustomed to having a keyboard on their phones, he never would’ve invented the iPhone’s touch screen keyboard.


Steve Ballmer tried to cater to people who were accustomed to having a keyboard on their phones, and we know what happened to him & the Windows phone. He got fired, and the Windows phone got discontinued.


Here’s Steve Ballmer in 2007, acting very similarly to the Airtable team in 2021:




I think that the video above is the best analogy that I could give to Airtable, and unfortunately, Christy’s comments above do not inspire confidence that anything has changed internally.



Perhaps. But I was just using that as an example. I work with the bosses & managers directly — who are the actual “creators” (not “editors”) of their own database systems — and they are also frustrated by accidentally creating new fields throughout the day.



Thank you for reminding @Christy_Roach that you are also NOT in favor of this design decision.


And I appreciate you playing devil’s advocate here, so I can respond to your comments:



This is totally true. A database system is never truly finished.


But 2 important things to note here:



  1. Creating new fields is only a small part of continually evolving a database system. There are so many other things that have nothing to do with creating new fields: Automations, views, scripts, external tools, apps, etc. The amount of times that we are now accidentally prompted with creating a new field is absolutely disproportionate to the amount of times that we actually NEED to create a new field.

  2. Anybody who is actually developing the system knows how to create new fields. When people are clicking to the right of the grid with their mouse, they are always doing it to clear their cursor from being inside one of the fields. They are doing it to clear the drop-down menu in a single-select field, or they are doing it to clear the drop-down choices in a linked record fields, or they are doing it to clear the drop-down choices in a multi-select field. etc. etc.


Even people who are using Microsoft Excel are accustomed to the same behavior: When a dropdown menu appears in Excel, they click into an empty area of the screen to clear the dropdown menu.


It concerns me that Christy and her team are not actually watching how people are using their mouse throughout their experience with Airtable. As @Bill.French said above, if Airtable was paying attention to their users’ behaviors, Airtable would see how many dozens of times per day users create & then cancel out of creating a new field.


A surprise interface element should never pop up on their screen, when all the user wanted to do was clear their cursor from a field.



Sure, but people are only a new user once. On their very first day of using the product. Even if it takes them 5 minutes to figure out how to create a new field, I don’t believe that the entire interface should then be ruined from that point forward into the future, simply because we wanted to help a brand new user on their very first day of using Airtable who doesn’t want to spend a few moments to learn a new platform.


In my personal case: I use Airtable on both a Mac web browser & an iPad web browser (where Airtable finally works properly with scrolling!), and the hundreds of times I have now accidentally created new fields in the last 2 months is mind-boggling.


It’s especially difficult on the iPad, where there’s not much screen space to begin with. All I want to do is clear my cursor out of a single-select field, or clear my cursor out of a multi-select field, etc… but nope, the new field dialog box pops up every time I accidentally tap to the right of the grid.


What Christy and the Airtable Team don’t seem to understand is that every time I log into a client’s Airtable database to help them with their system, I have to clean up all of the extraneous fields that my client has created in their system.


How is this making people’s lives easier?


What Airtable fails to understand is that users instinctively want to click to the right of the grid to clear the mouse from a field.


Even people who come from a spreadsheet background instinctively click to the right of their fields (or in any blank area of the screen) to clear a drop-down list in their Excel spreadsheet. Where else would a user go to clear a drop-down list?



Yes, but we shouldn’t debilitate our product for ALL users in order to cater to NEW users in order to “baby them” into a new product. They should simply do what everyone else has done: learn the new product. Creating a field is easy.


We can’t damage an entire platform to cater to new users who don’t want to spend a few minutes learning how the brand new platform works. It makes no sense.


If Steve Jobs wanted to cater to people who were accustomed to having a keyboard on their phones, he never would’ve invented the iPhone’s touch screen keyboard.


Steve Ballmer tried to cater to people who were accustomed to having a keyboard on their phones, and we know what happened to him & the Windows phone. He got fired, and the Windows phone got discontinued.


Here’s Steve Ballmer in 2007, acting very similarly to the Airtable team in 2021:




I think that the video above is the best analogy that I could give to Airtable, and unfortunately, Christy’s comments above do not inspire confidence that anything has changed internally.



Perhaps. But I was just using that as an example. I work with the bosses & managers directly — who are the actual “creators” (not “editors”) of their own database systems — and they are also frustrated by accidentally creating new fields throughout the day.



Agreed.


We can’t assume they have such capacity to monitor for metrics the likes of which I have suggested, but they should. Any team that is quick to call out metrics (of ANY type) concerning useability outcomes must be very careful about confirmation bias and I think the metrics they have mentioned thus far fall into this trap. The only way to eliminate confirmation bias is to gather metrics from many perspectives to craft a true picture of user behaviours. Uncharacteristically, product managers must seek out the perspectives that provide the worst possible outcomes.


The data will tell you precisely how to shape the product - you just need to acquire the data and the data I’ve seen suggests the current UI/UX has some downsides like non-trivial spikes schema alterations as reported by Sync Inc.


I’ve never seen a product transition from such a delight to use to an absolute catastrophe, and I’ve never experienced such abject nonchalance from a product team either.


This has led to really disappointing outcomes for me, and I will admit I’m now using other software wherever I can.


💔


I’ve never seen a product transition from such a delight to use to an absolute catastrophe, and I’ve never experienced such abject nonchalance from a product team either.


This has led to really disappointing outcomes for me, and I will admit I’m now using other software wherever I can.


💔



I totally agree 1,000%. That’s 10 times more than 100%!


And, as all of us predicted (and I even offered a wager on it), we have never again heard from @Christy_Roach nor any Airtable employees in this thread. :man_shrugging:


:tumbleweeds:



I would argue that you & I are sharing the exact same experience. When I click to the right of the grid in Airtable, 99.99% of the time it is to clear the focus.


Which is why this change is so detrimental.


There is nothing subjective about this. It is objectively a bad UI decision.


I would love for @Christy_Roach (or any other Airtable employee) to let us know where we are supposed to click to clear the focus.


@Christy_Roach: Where should we click to clear our focus?



Lol! Good job! We can see how well the “promises” have held up! :roll_eyes:


I’m still waiting for all of my questions to be answered, both in this message and my previous messages.





So, my posts are being flagged faster than I can click reply, but this gets through? 🤣


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